An Ethical Remake of a Remake of Madness

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An Ethical Remake of a Remake of Madness

Postby marjo on Thu Dec 19, 2013 10:25 pm

Just about everyone around here knows about Lords Madness.
Ken75 has made a couple of remakes of the legendary design, but in all of these madnesses (including the original) the rightmost weight that unfolds the bridge takes advantage of joint snapping to remove itself from the bridge when it is no longer necessary.
So... I decided that that wasn't good enough and set off to make what I think is a more "ethical" design, one that does not involve intended glitching.
I started with Ken75's Robin's Tail.
I changed a few pieces to make the weight phase off rather than snap off: http://www.fantasticcontraption.com/?designId=11993059 (which to me is considerably more OK).
Then, I thought that maybe the design could be rid of glitches entirely, so I changed around a few more things and came up with this, the final, glitch-less, "ethical" modification of a remake: http://www.fantasticcontraption.com/?designId=11993064
Go forth and solve....
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Re: An Ethical Remake of a Remake of Madness

Postby ken75 on Fri Dec 20, 2013 7:21 pm

Just one comment on a small part of this... Why on earth do you think phasing is considerably more okay than breaking? Imagine having a mechanism in real life that involved solid parts being yanked right through each other. Now imagine one that has a rope snapping. Which seems more okay again?
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Re: An Ethical Remake of a Remake of Madness

Postby marjo on Sun Dec 22, 2013 11:00 am

Haha, I thought someone might say something like that, here is my rational, accept it if you want:
First of all, we have to realize that fc, no matter how realistic parts of it are, is not completely realistic, but let's get back to the topic at hand.
In life we have two types of changes. Those are physical and chemical changes. A physical change can be (at least in theory) reversed to get the same object back. So, for example, bending a piece of paper. In practice, undoing a crease is virtually impossible, but the idea is is that it theoretically can be unbent into the same piece of paper. Nothing chemically is changed, it is the same piece of paper, only STATE has changed.
Now let's consider chemical changes. Cooking an egg, for example, is a chemical change, and results in a different substance than before. (It's easier to see when burning gasoline, another chemical change, where the gasoline turns into carbon dioxide and water, which are completely different substances). It is considerably harder to "uncook" an egg than to unfold paper, maybe even impossible as a matter of fact. This is a more RADICAL change than a physical change.
Now, let's go back to Fantastic Contraption. Phasing is like a physical change. you can phase something through something else, and then you can phase it back. More importantly is is the same contraption, just in a different STATE.
However, joint snapping is like a chemical change. Once a joint is snapped it cannot be unsnapped, and the contraption is now a different one. This is a more RADICAL change, and therefore, at least to me, is a worse form of glitch. I get it, in real life it doesn't work like that, but in FC, phasing doesn't really change the contraption, but joints breaking does.
I understand your rational, but this is mine. :)
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Re: An Ethical Remake of a Remake of Madness

Postby lord_hamybal on Mon Dec 23, 2013 12:24 pm

i don't mind what ever you do. but glitch is a glitch. this ain't physical this ain't chemical.
this is a game. if you don't like like breaking a joint, you shouldn't say phasing is better. both are not Correct ways.

if you want to do this better i expected no glitches/bugs. otherwise in my opinion you wouldn't have done any better.

so good luck:)
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Re: An Ethical Remake of a Remake of Madness

Postby marjo on Mon Dec 23, 2013 4:54 pm

Wow, I didn't expect this to get this controversial, that one piece of text in parentheses wasn't supposed to be that important, but in any case :), anyway, Rémy you may have missed the last few lines along with the link: http://www.fantasticcontraption.com/?designId=11993064
:D That's the one without the glitch.
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Re: An Ethical Remake of a Remake of Madness

Postby electronic12345 on Mon Dec 23, 2013 4:57 pm

Nice job Marjo!
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Re: An Ethical Remake of a Remake of Madness

Postby marjo on Mon Dec 23, 2013 5:01 pm

Thanks electronic!, it was all the work of those two though :).
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Re: An Ethical Remake of a Remake of Madness

Postby lord_hamybal on Mon Dec 23, 2013 5:41 pm

i'm sorry.

good job, and you are the first to write my name like it should.

not that i mind :)
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Re: An Ethical Remake of a Remake of Madness

Postby marjo on Mon Dec 23, 2013 5:59 pm

That's ok, you did nothing wrong, haha yes I have a website for special symbols bookmarked so I thought I might as well use it ;).
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